Dana Harper: Money Talks with Female Leaders
Dana Harper is an accomplished problem solver and entrepreneurial leader with both human capital expertise and experience running a P&L. With over 25 years of work experience with companies like Accenture, GE, and JLL, Dana has optimized business value through end-to-end Talent Management, Human Capital Strategy, and HR initiatives. She is taking her vast knowledge of how both people and businesses work and is growing Dana Harper Consulting & Coaching, doing both HR consulting and leadership coaching.
Money Talks are hosted by Lisa Clements, owner of Clear Springs Wealth. Lisa is a financial strategist and investment manager who specializes in helping professional female leaders secure their financial future. She builds ongoing relationships with her clients, helping them save money in taxes, build wealth through investments, and make sound financial decisions for the future.
How To Connect with Lisa:
•Download 3 Free Savings Hacks 1 Page PDF
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•Submit a money question for Lisa to answer in an upcoming episode
Full Transcript:
Interview with Dana Harper
[00:00:00] Dana: It's like we're focused on one thing for so long, that it is a huge adjustment, and it is a huge mindset shift that you have to keep working on... to allow yourself to live that life, to redefine what success looks like for you, and to celebrate not being on a conference call at 2:30 in the afternoon on Thursday, but rather reading a book by your pool. To celebrate that, has been a mindset shift for me and something that I continue to work on.
[00:00:35] Lisa: Welcome. I'm Lisa Clements, founder of Clear Springs Wealth. Money Talks with Female Leaders aims to break taboos surrounding women and money and boost your own financial confidence. You'll hear powerhouse women share their personal and professional experiences with money. They tackle questions spanning from why money is important, how money has shaped their careers, and how much they spend on a bottle of wine or a one week vacation.
I hope [00:01:00] you enjoy.
Hello, Dana. It has been years since you and I worked together at Accenture.
[00:01:07] Dana: Really happy to reconnect with you.
[00:01:10] Lisa: I'm so thankful you're doing this. I would love to dig right in and have you tell everyone how old you are now, your social status, and if you have any pets. And then we'll talk about career stuff.
So let's start with the fun personal stuff.
[00:01:28] Dana: Sure. Yeah. I am 51. I am married. I do have a dog. I also have a kid in college. Did I miss anything?
[00:01:38] Lisa: No. What's the dog's name?
[00:01:40] Dana: Soki..
[00:01:41] Lisa: Soakki. And your son is 18, right? Henry?
[00:01:44] Dana: Yes. Yes. Henry's 18.
[00:01:47] Lisa: Fantastic. So you're empty nesting it this year?
[00:01:50] Dana: Yes, I am. It's been a big adjustment for me.
[00:01:53] Lisa: I can only imagine. I can only imagine. So tell us how many years of career [00:02:00] experience you have and then maybe give us some career highlights and your current business pursuits.
[00:02:07] Dana: Yeah. So I have been working for 29 years. I have worked all over the world. I've worked in the UK with clients in France and Ireland.
I worked in Australia with clients in that region. And I had the privilege to work with people in the Philippines and India, really all over the world. And so that cross-cultural piece is something that I'm quite proud of. And then, I also am an HR person who also has experience running a P&L for a Fortune 100 company.
And so what I've been doing is... coaching people who are at career crossroads, either determining whether they want to stay in their current career with different coping mechanisms or to leave their career and start something new, entrepreneurial.
And I'm [00:03:00] also doing HR consulting. Yeah.
[00:03:03] Lisa: Awesome. So a little bit of everything just keeps you plate full.
[00:03:07] Dana: Yes.
[00:03:08] Lisa: I love it. I love it. I, being a corporate transitioning girl myself, I think there's a huge need for the coaching that you're providing and can't think of anyone better suited for it than you.
So...
[00:03:23] Dana: I absolutely love it.
[00:03:25] Lisa: Good. So I want to talk about money in three different main areas. First of all, in your past. And then money in your career and then money today and how you spend it. So let's start with money in your past with my favorite question of all. I'll just start with it right out of the gate, which is why is money important to you?
[00:03:51] Dana: So money became important to me as I became a single mom. And it was the means by which, excuse me, I [00:04:00] needed to support my son. Really early on in his childhood, I needed to be very able to take care of him and his needs by myself.
[00:04:11] Lisa: Okay. And you became a single mom at 33, 34?
[00:04:19] Dana: 35. Yes.
[00:04:21] Lisa: Okay. All right. Very good. Holy cow. So had you already been working at that point in time?
[00:04:29] Dana: Yes, I was working for Accenture at the time.
[00:04:32] Lisa: Okay.
[00:04:32] Dana: And I had just gotten promoted to Senior Manager when Henry was born. And so,after I decided that the marriage wasn't going to work.
I took an assignment in the UK, because I did want to advance my career, and I did want to start making more money. That's where the whole international experience came into play for me.
[00:04:55] Lisa: Got it. Would you say that money became important to you [00:05:00] when you became a single mother. How would you say it's important to you today, now that your son is at college, and it's you and your husband today? Does that answer change at all or has it changed at all?
[00:05:14] Dana: It does. I think it expands. Obviously, Henry is still primary concern and making sure that he's got tuition and all those sorts of things are taken care of. But, now, being at the stage of life that I'm in, it's important to me that I go on vacation. I have experiences. And that I'm taking care of from a retirement perspective. So I think where before I had tunnel vision, the use of money has expanded for me.
[00:05:44] Lisa: Okay. That totally makes sense. Thank you. Okay, so when you were growing up, was money talked about at home?
[00:05:53] Dana: No. It wasn't. The primary reason is that [00:06:00] we had enough of it. And my father's philosophy was... spend it all. It was the experiences, the homes, the cars... he didn't want to take any of it with him, is what his philosophy was.
[00:06:15] Lisa: Okay.
[00:06:16] Dana: And I didn't get any of the education that I saw my male peers at Accenture putting into action. Just being around the hallways and things and conference rooms after things. Meetings would end; I would hear, my male peers having conversations about stock options and when the right time to buy those was, and I didn't have any of that knowledge, but I noticed that most of them did.
[00:06:45] Lisa: Interesting. Okay. Growing up the way you did, did you have any pre-programmed money script in your mind as you went into adulthood?
[00:06:54] Dana: Yeah, I think I just thought it was something fun to play with. Sure, there were [00:07:00] mortgages and cars and childcare and things like that.
But disposable income was something that I think that I used to alleviate stress, right? Like to go shopping, to go on extravagant vacations and things like that. So I do think that was the script I had in my head.
[00:07:21] Lisa: Okay. What about today? Is it a similar money script? Do you have any, quote unquote, money beliefs that you think influence how you live today?
[00:07:31] Dana: Yeah. I've done a complete 180. Really. I am very watchful of where our money goes. I shop around for the best deals. I use artificial intelligence plugins on my browser to make sure that I'm getting $4 off, on some of the beauty products that I use all the time.
So I've [00:08:00] really done a complete turnaround. And it is because I decided to leave corporate and focus on my passions that I had to, I had to change the way that I spent.
[00:08:15] Lisa: Okay. Oh, good. We're going to talk more about that. Okay. Let's talk about money and your career. When you were working such a demanding career, you were married. You had done the demanding career as a single and then demanding career as a married with a child. How did you handle your finances while you were in Australia, in the UK, in the US, how did you stay on top of everything?
[00:08:44] Dana: I have a spreadsheet that I have to this day, that people ask me for.
[00:08:49] Lisa: Okay.
[00:08:49] Dana: Because I keep track of all of my expenses.
And then, as the month goes by, I mark down what [00:09:00] has been paid already, so I know where I am. Now in the past, that was so I could gauge where the excess was going to go and what fun I was going to have with that. But now, it's more about investing or keeping that money in a high yield savings account.
Watching my money grow in a high yield savings account now at this point in my life, is more fun than buying clothes used to be. I always had a spreadsheet and then, with currency conversions, there were times when I would need to transfer money to and from the United States to where I was living at the time. And I had to really stay on top of what bank I was using in the country I was living, and what their policies were with regard to transferring money internationally.
[00:09:53] Lisa: Okay. All right. What role did money play in how you managed your career? [00:10:00]
[00:10:00] Dana: I definitely went for roles with progressive experience with the anticipation that I would be given a raise. I did negotiate higher salaries each time that I moved and each time that I took a bigger role.
[00:10:21] Lisa: Even though it was within the same organization?
[00:10:24] Dana: Yes.
[00:10:25] Lisa: Ooh, interesting. Okay.
[00:10:28] Dana: And I want to add something here.
[00:10:31] Lisa: Yeah.
[00:10:32] Dana: I did not know about the wage disparity that there was at Accenture, between genders. And I remember a time sitting in my sister-in-law's house, just outside of London, and I was given a $25,000 raise one year. And I know it was the CEO's doing at that [00:11:00] particular year to make wage equity more real in the company because he was raising a daughter and felt that she should be compensated fairly when she entered the workforce.
And I was shocked and obviously pleased, but then I also thought about how much income I didn't earn in the years before that action took place.
[00:11:29] Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. That is a mixed blessing, so to speak. I'm so happy it's been rectified. So frustrated it was there in the first place. Did you ever take a career risk? As you took on new roles, was there anything that you were genuinely scared of or nervous about, but you were going after it for the higher income, higher level promotion, those types of things?
[00:11:58] Dana: I do think it was quite [00:12:00] brave of me to move to the United Kingdom, not knowing anyone with a two year old um, that was certainly a risk.
And then, when we moved to Australia with him. That was also certainly a risk. And then when I decided to leave Accenture and go into more startup environments. That was also a risk. So I think I have been more willing to take career risks, than I've seen other people be willing to do, to get that higher pay or that bigger role.
[00:12:36] Lisa: When you left Accenture and went to the couple of startups you worked at, was it a couple I think, yeah?
[00:12:43] Dana: Yeah.
[00:12:44] Lisa: Did you negotiate in those salary conversations?
[00:12:48] Dana: I was not able to negotiate very strongly in those situations because of cash flow realities. I made a purposeful decision that I wanted [00:13:00] to take some sort of like steps back a little bit in my career and not go after some of those higher salary roles, because I noticed that they came with, and this is not going to be a surprise to you, but they came with a lot more stress than some of the roles that are lower on the food chain. And I wanted the less stress situations.
[00:13:25] Lisa: Okay. What brought about your biggest pay increases? Was it the international roles, do you think, or just the fact that you were constantly taking new opportunities?
[00:13:41] Dana: It was the international roles, because I was able to analyze the cost of living in those situations and get what I needed, to live the same, baseline of lifestyle when I did that. But then, you're right. Taking on [00:14:00] greater and greater roles also helped.
[00:14:02] Lisa: Okay. Have you ever invested in your own professional development to boost your earning potential?
[00:14:09] Dana: Yes. So when I took a little bit of a left turn at Accenture and went into sales best practice, and it was something that I hadn't done before. I invested in Brendan Burchard's program. So I did coaching with one of his practitioners because I did wantto get that promotion into Managing Director at Accenture, and I knew that being in sales was just going to be a little bit different. So I just, I wanted to elevate my game. Yes. And it was a big investment. It was $12,000 at the time.
[00:14:46] Lisa: Oh my gosh. Did it pay off for you in the position in sales?
[00:14:52] Dana: No. And I think, and it's, this is certainly not a reflection on the program, on Brendan, but... [00:15:00] No, I ended up being laid off because Accenture regionalized. My sponsors were on either coast. Henry was in high school, I didn't want to move that particular moment in time.
In fact, one of their sales people called me recently. And she asked me the same question. And I said, to be honest, I don't even remember some of the techniques. I remember one, and this was a long program, right? This was a, I think it was a six-month program. And I don't remember some of those tips and tricks.
[00:15:36] Dana: I think for me, the way I have learned best is more on demand when I need something right now, then I'll plug in something. Like, when I ran a P&L, that was very huge learning curve for me. And so I would go and learn things about what is a backlog, right? Or, what is, 10 [00:16:00] percent growth? Or how do I create that kind of growth in revenue? So I felt like those plug in times were a little bit more effective for me.
[00:16:09] Lisa: Okay. I totally get that. I too feel like, especially when in my own career change from corporate to finance. There's so much, a breadth of all these things you learn, but it's once I started tax planning that then I was like, "Oh, now I get what they were talking about." But it's, yeah, it's almost like that point in time is almost more influential. Along your career, I can't imagine you had the time, but did you ever or have you ever pursued a side hustle to make more income?
[00:16:46] Dana: I didn't, because I did not have time. I absolutely worked a lot of hours. My pattern was to get up early, work like a full day, go to [00:17:00] the gym, and then start working again in nighttime. And I had a full time, live-in nanny for Henry until he was 14 years old.
[00:17:09] Lisa: I get it. So let's talk about money and spending today. Have you ever experienced an unexpected financial setback? And how did you recover?
[00:17:24] Dana: Yes. My most recent startup employment ended abruptly. And that is when I made the decision to leave corporate and pursue something else. And, I hired a financial planner to help me understand what I needed to do, to adjust my life to the new level of income that I had. So we downsized our home, we moved to a lower tax burden state. We made some pretty big changes in order to [00:18:00] recover from that situation.
[00:18:02] Lisa: Interesting. I think as much as that change is massive and not to be trivialized, I so admire your willingness to say, "Okay, here are some steps we're going to take. We're going to downsize. We're going to move to a state with the lower tax burden," just being willing to do what you have to do, and make it work. What have you outsourced in your life? And maybe we should say while you were working, what did you outsource? And then while you're pursuing your own business pursuits, what have you outsourced versus what have you kept?
[00:18:38] Dana: Yeah, so child care, obviously um, cleaning, yard care, really anything that I could outsource when I was working that hard, I did. Down to sometimes using a concierge type service to plan a vacation or pick something up for [00:19:00] me. My focus was pretty much entirely on work.
And now, as you can imagine, the opposite is true. But except for, there's some house maintenance things that I don't know how to do, and then that I learned the importance of keeping up with in the move. I had not kept up with some house maintenance things over the years. As I said, I spent my money on vacations and things like that. And so we got some unpleasant surprises at the end of the day in the home that we lived in Chicago. And so now it's my intention to make sure that those house maintenance things stay up to date because they can end up costing you more later if you let them fester.
[00:19:44] Lisa: Interesting. Okay. Good advice. Good advice. Have you and Grant had a bogey for how much you want to have for retirement? Have you had a magic number?
[00:19:55] Dana: We never have, until we started using you as our [00:20:00] financial planner. I don't think we have a bogey right now because I'm still building my businesses, but we definitely are paying attention and are moving towards having something like in place, yes.
[00:20:14] Lisa: Okay. Great. What do you think are some financial goals that women in their thirties, forties and fifties should set for themselves?
[00:20:25] Dana: I think the savings piece is the piece for me. I missed just the opportunities to invest, in, in Accenture. So savings, investments, having some level of commitment to yourself and your future that you're doing those things as soon as you possibly can, and then the growing that commitment over time.
[00:20:54] Lisa: Yeah.
I'm wondering if you would be comfortable talking at all about [00:21:00] that decision to not stay on... I don't want to call it rat race because, it's not. It's a meaningful journey that we all take in our careers.
And if you're at all programmed for achievement or whatever it is that's motivating you, every next step is an exciting one and something that we're always aspiring to. But at some point in our lives, I don't know if it's an age range, I don't know if it's a career level. Once you hit VP, Senior Director, is it that level where you have to choose?
Are you going to give your life blood to continue to grow, as far as career wise and money wise or... Are you going to go for more life balance? Are you going to say, "Hey, I'm willing to move from Chicago to Arizona in order to live a life that is more true to [00:22:00] who I am as an individual?"
How have you managed that adjustment mentally? Because I think it's a massive challenge, at least for me, for my ego. On LinkedIn, I'm not a Senior Director. I'm not a Chief People Officer anymore. And there are many nights when I go to bed thinking, "Oh, I bet everyone I've ever worked with looks at my profile on LinkedIn and thinks, what a loser," which I'm sure no one cares, but have you had to struggle with that at all?
[00:22:35] Dana: But yes. I met someone who wascounsel for <omitted> . Our kids were in school together and she had to take a step backward. I told her, I was thinking about doing that. And she said the biggest thing you're going to struggle with is your ego. It is the biggest thing you are going to struggle with.
I'm just here to tell you, and I didn't do the step back role at that [00:23:00] time. But she's right. And even, the VP that I was talking to that I'm friends with, in Chicago. Just earlier this week, he said he was struggling with his ego, right? It is. It's like we're focused on one thing for so long that it is a huge adjustment.
And it is a huge mindset shift that you have to keep working on. To allow yourself to live that life, to redefine what success looks like for you and to celebrate not being on a conference call at 2:30 in the afternoon on Thursday, but rather reading a book by your pool. To celebrate that, has been a mindset shift for me and something that I continue to work on.
[00:23:49] Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. I love that. Thank you for sharing that. I think I'll continue to wrestle with it. And yet, we're talking on a Friday [00:24:00] afternoon and I'm probably going to knock off early after we're done talking and never would have done that before.
[00:24:06] Dana: That's right. I'm going to go to the gym after we talk, and then I'm going to participate in some self-development. I'm learning as much as I can right now about AI and its applications for people that I'm coaching and also, in HR, in my consulting business. So yeah, I, I really have to work at celebrating those things, but they are things to celebrate.
[00:24:31] Lisa: Yes, I absolutely agree. Okay, let's go to our speed round.
You've made it to the end. So tell me, Dana, what is one thing you'll splurge on?
[00:24:44] Dana: Today, in the way that I'm living, I am splurging on personal training sessions. I'm really enjoying working with someone on fitness. And I don't do other things. Like I don't go and get my nails done because I [00:25:00] am splurging on the personal training. Because it's just, the checks and balances. In the past, as soon as I got my bonus at Accenture, I'd buy Christmas presents and I'd buy something, a luxury good for myself.
So I have several Louis Vuitton bags. I have a diamond tennis bracelet, have several luxury watches. And now that I wear an Apple watch, they never get any use. I don't need a diamond tennis bracelet. I never wear it. So my spending has changed dramatically over the last little while here.
[00:25:36] Lisa: Okay. Oh, that's fascinating. What's one thing you're super frugal with?
[00:25:41] Dana: Really, I'm frugal with everything now. I have the digital coupons for fries on my phone. I do use Rocket Money to look at my subscriptions, see if there's any way to lower my bills.
[00:25:55] Lisa: Okay.
[00:25:56] Dana: Yeah, so I've gotten rid of subscriptions I don't need. [00:26:00] I actually... changed to clothing subscriptions so that I was not investing in clothing but more, doing rotations. I have a couple of those. So I'm very frugal with everything now.
[00:26:16] Lisa: Okay. All right. So tell me what's the right percentage to tip when you go out?
[00:26:23] Dana: That's a hard one for me. I feel like this moment in time, the cost of things are quite high, and yet I know those people are paid, a big portion of what they're paid is in tips, and so it ranges for me. Depending on the service, anywhere from 10 to 20%.
[00:26:44] Lisa: Okay. Got it. Amount to spend on a car?
[00:26:48] Dana: I do like a reliable car, and I'm still a little in my status [00:27:00] symbol mindset on that one. Somewhere between 60, 70, maybe even up to $80,000 on a car.
[00:27:11] Lisa: How about how much to spend on a bottle of wine?
[00:27:14] Dana: That's changed. Yes. I like Rombauer, but I don't buy it.
At a restaurant, I think it could be like about $100 for a bottle. I've actually reduced the amount of drinking I do drastically as well as I have gotten older. And I think $30 to $40 at a restaurant is plenty.
[00:27:39] Lisa: Okay. All right. What if you're buying a bottle for you and Grant to share?
[00:27:44] Dana: At the store?
[00:27:45] Lisa: Yeah.
[00:27:46] Dana: $20 probably.
[00:27:48] Lisa: Okay. What is the right budget for a one week vacation?
[00:27:54] Dana: This has changed as well. Last summer, we took Henry to Austria because we [00:28:00] knew that it was probably going to be one of our final family vacations, like that. And that ended up costing, I think somewhere in the $15,000 range. And now, we want to do smaller vacations. We live in Arizona. So I like to do a long weekend in Sedona, and I don't want it to cost over $1,000. It's very different. Yeah, it's very different.
[00:28:24] Lisa: Okay, that's great. How much would you spend on a purse? And we should say before and after.
[00:28:30] Dana: Yes. So before... I do have purses that cost $2,000 and above. And now I absolutely wouldn't. I don't think I'd spend over $250.
[00:28:43] Lisa: Okay. All right.
[00:28:44] Dana: I will say though, that I do a lot of consignment shopping.
[00:28:48] Lisa: All right.
[00:28:48] Dana: And, yes if I want something like that, I look for it on consignment.
[00:28:53] Lisa: Okay. What is the most extravagant purchase you've ever made?
[00:28:59] Dana: [00:29:00] Probably the tennis bracelet.
[00:29:03] Lisa: If you need me to take that off your hands, I will.Do you have a favorite money related quote or mantra?
[00:29:11] Dana: I don't. I think it's more like a mindset shift now around, um, be watchful. I remind myself frequently, be watchful. Yeah.
[00:29:24] Lisa: I love that. I love that. I cannot thank you enough, my friend for taking time to talk with me about this. I am hoping that our conversations help other women become more aware, feel a little more normal, understand the trade offs that we make when it comes to money and advocate for ourselves a lot more.
[00:29:47] Dana: My pleasure. I'm so excited that you're doing this, because I think, like you said about my niche, I think this is very needed in the world that we're living in today.
[00:29:58] Lisa: Awesome. All [00:30:00] right. Thank you.
[00:30:01] Dana: Thank you. Thanks for listening. Money Talks are hosted by myself, Lisa Clements, owner of Clear Springs Wealth. If you enjoyed this episode, share it with someone you think could benefit from talking more about money. Make sure you leave a rating, a review and subscribe so you never miss an episode. You can find show notes at clearspringswealth.com/moneytalks. Thanks so much.
